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Robert
-9th December 2003, 15:59
I'm looking for a few training exercises to develop effective counters to flick hits in the outside line and to the shoulder. People have suggested variously: turning the body, stepping in, stop hitting and stepping back, stepping back beat attack, parries of tierce, neuvieme and high sixte.

All great in principle but there is still a gap to fill on putting them into practice. Can anyone suggest any training exercises that will develop any of these defences, assuming no-one I practice against flick hits. Excercises I can do on my own would be great, if not I can probably rope in a beginner to do partner work on any particular sequence of moves.

Robert

Hudson
-9th December 2003, 19:44
don't have any tips but you could try my approach. If they are one of these flick hiters how when they come forward look as if they are casting of with a fishing rod (always moving there arm backward and forwards) Try arguing that they are breaking time when you counter attack. (be carful though i git red carded and threatened with a black foe having a very heated debate with the ref.

Prometheus
-10th December 2003, 00:02
Alternatively, excel in footwork - draw the final action with a change in cadence (big step,small step or slow step, fast step) and take a step back as the opponent leans in the final action.

The attack fails, you gently beat the opponents blade and hit him. Moral and actual victory, and of course one light. Plus he may have to try a different tactic after that which makes foil really interesting.

Therefore go away and practise footwork with varying cadence and ensure you are balanced throughout.

The point is footwork is the fundamental technique in all fencing, if you wish to be a great fencer practise footwork for half an hour a day.

Prometheus (who wishes he had the time to do so himself)

Winwaloe
-10th December 2003, 15:52
Robert -suggest you find a partner who can flick and then spend some club time working on parries and very preferably parry/riposte. The conventions of flick hitting are probably fine at national and international comps but lower down the food chain you will find it different. A good parry/riposte is best. Problem with a stop hit is the resultant "conversation" re time! - Have fun

srb
-10th December 2003, 21:24
Distance, distance, distance =
footwork, footwork, footwork.

Make the distance yours. To take a parry as Winwaloe suggests, the distance has to at your parrying distance, and not their attcking distance. However, much safer to either close the distance or preferably extend the distance.

srb (even more lazy than Prometheus)

sparkymark567
-11th December 2003, 11:53
srb:

So using this method you never get hit on the back, right?

I'd go for the parry option, the distance does have to be spot on but I'd say it was safer than closing distance. Also you mentioned breaking distance, but this will leave you right on the end of the piste.

If you can't beat them, join them. A parry neuveme with flick reposte is probably the most effective method.

srb
-11th December 2003, 12:29
Originally posted by sparkymark567
srb:

So using this method you never get hit on the back, right?



Yeah, but who won???

srb (stepping back and being hit less by sparkymark than normal)

sparkymark567
-11th December 2003, 17:38
Originally posted by srb
Yeah, but who won???

John Lockwood, if I'm not mistaken.

Rdb811
-11th December 2003, 23:39
Is there a method of defending that doesn't require hard work or ability ?

devalleassoc
-12th December 2003, 02:32
Yeah, LIE DOWN AND PLAY DEAD!!!:confused:

sparkymark567
-12th December 2003, 12:25
There is one thing that might help you. Keep your back nice and straight at all times. A flick reposte will normally arrive when you're leaning forward at the end of an attack. Keep your body upright and less flicks will land.
Also, make sure you hit your opponent every time they miss.

Dave Hillier
-12th December 2003, 12:34
Change speed and distance. If you are retreating at the same speed they can predict where you will be and still hit you, changing speed makes this much harder.

Respond at the last possible moment IE once they are irrevocably committed to the attack. If you move to soon (IE parry or change distance) they will change line and still hit you.


Is there a method of defending that doesn't require hard work or ability

Well you can just step in to the attack. Take the flick landing flat on your shoulder, anglulate and hit them.

Not really recomended though.

sparkymark567
-12th December 2003, 12:53
That's what srb said. Trouble is, you'll probably still get hit especially if the person at the other end is any good.

Your method will work some of the time. A risky game of chance.

Dave Hillier
-12th December 2003, 12:59
That's what srb said.

Oh yeah, oops.

They do however work against the majority of flicky kids and you need to wade though a fair number of them at some competitions.

srb
-12th December 2003, 19:13
Originally posted by sparkymark567
John Lockwood, if I'm not mistaken.

You know what I mean!!!

srb (until the 12th, and hoping for foil sharpeners for Christmas)