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UglyBug
-7th May 2004, 08:40
In both FHM and Front this month, fencing shoes have featured in the fashion pages as the trainers to have this summer. In Front, it was some by Le Coq Sportif and in FHM, some adidas gold stripes. Are these actually new types of shoes that are new to market? Does anyone actually use them to fence in?

Ulrika
-7th May 2004, 10:41
These are the originals from the Olympics in 1964! (http://thestore.adidas.com/cgi-bin/adilive/b2c/product-concept.w?type=CONCP&code=C0001&all=yes&style=S8370) :tongue:
Now suddenly very trendy (and expensive)! *ouch*

UglyBug
-7th May 2004, 11:43
I wish they'd re-release the black stripes as fashionable/vintage! Does anyone know owt about the le coq sportif ones?

reposte
-7th May 2004, 17:39
it's a beautiful picture, but even the crappy Dartagnan Adidas look wonderful on picture.

oddball
-7th May 2004, 19:34
Viktoria fencing shoes are good, LP were selling some on fairly (!) cheap a few weeks back.

gbm
-7th May 2004, 21:06
Fencing shoes are apparently designed for metallic pistes, and thus are terrible on dusty floors. But will they (specifically Viktoria's) work fine on wooden floors if you wipe down the shoes with a wet cloth throughout the fight like some fencers do?

uk_45
-7th May 2004, 21:38
Hmm if fencering shoes become fasionable we will have to pay even more for them!

gbm
-7th May 2004, 21:46
But once they stop being fashionable, there will be loads of surplus shoes to buy cheap!

Now about my shoe-question...

symon
-7th May 2004, 22:55
they've got those Adidas Trainers in my local Richmond Classics Clothes shop ( super expensive designer label shop :rolleyes: )
they want about 60 quid for a pair of em!!!!

Aer
-8th May 2004, 01:56
pair of normal trainers : £20 quid
Pair of Cricket Spikes: £50 quid
Pair of Fencing shoes: £35 quid
Pair of wetshoes : £75

for feet theres shoes. for buying them theres mastercard:tongue:

uk_45
-8th May 2004, 17:00
Fencing Shoes: £35
Sabre Mask: £100
Lamé: £118
Winning: Priceless

There somthing's money can't buy for everything else there's Leon Paul

Australian
-8th May 2004, 17:52
Adidas fencing assymetrics, £90 :o

*sigh* the price i pay for comfy feet

Aer
-8th May 2004, 19:37
do you have a link there austrailian?

Ulrika
-8th May 2004, 20:20
Adidas "Equipment 2000" (aka. the Assymetrics). (http://www.allstar-fencing.co.uk/jpgs/506r.jpg)

uk_45
-8th May 2004, 20:37
I'm going to have to get me a pair of them!

Juicy
-8th May 2004, 22:17
Originally posted by Australian
Adidas fencing assymetrics, £90 :o

*sigh* the price i pay for comfy feet

I actually found them quite uncomfortable and heavy when I tried them on. Also they're a bit crap to walk around normally with...
I'd definitely recommend Viktoria tho, cause enough people have told me how good they are :)

Australian
-8th May 2004, 22:39
Originally posted by Juicy
I actually found them quite uncomfortable and heavy when I tried them on. Also they're a bit crap to walk around normally with...

i swear by them :) and heavy? :confused:

and you get used to the feeling when you walk around... mind you, they're for fencing in, not walking :)

gbm
-8th May 2004, 22:39
Of course they're (Viktoria's or apparently Equipment's) not very much good unless you are lucky enough to be fencing on a metallic piste...

Australian
-8th May 2004, 22:41
Originally posted by goodbadandme
Of course they're (Viktoria's or apparently Equipment's) not very much good unless you are lucky enough to be fencing on a metallic piste...

i do slide around a little on non-metal pistes (a lot on polished floorboards) but its not that noticeable on a regularish surface

gbm
-8th May 2004, 22:46
I've just bought a pair of Viktoria's as LP were selling them off and I happened to be making an order at the time, then somebody pointed out they were designed for metallic pistes and I felt a bit silly. :o

nirvana
-9th May 2004, 12:25
Originally posted by Australian
i swear by them :) and heavy? :confused:

and you get used to the feeling when you walk around... mind you, they're for fencing in, not walking :)

Yep when i got mine I found them considerably heavier than the Dartagnans. Mine were half a size too big though. They didn't have any left handed size 8's.

pinkelephant
-9th May 2004, 15:06
d'Artagnans are good on slippery floors, but the asymmetrics are great and you soon get used to the "funny feel". The asymmetrics seem to come up a bit wider as well. I keep a pair of each for different floors.

uk_45
-9th May 2004, 15:17
D'arts aint good when you arn't awake and try to put them on tho!

oddball
-10th May 2004, 11:37
Originally posted by goodbadandme
Of course they're (Viktoria's or apparently Equipment's) not very much good unless you are lucky enough to be fencing on a metallic piste...

Fencing on polished floorboards is V-E-R-Y slippy with them, so in that situation a pair of £3.75 plimsolls is way better.

oddball
-10th May 2004, 11:38
Viktoria's are good for playing squash!

gbm
-10th May 2004, 11:53
What are the best shoes for your average dusty gym floor?

oddball
-10th May 2004, 11:57
The sort of average trainers worn for games at schools - ask a kid.

Insipiens
-10th May 2004, 12:04
£60 is exactly what LP ask for the addidas D'Artagnans. So getting the Addidas gold stripe at that price from the high street is not bad given how fashionable they are.

And how hideous are the asymmetrics! yeeuch:(

gbm
-10th May 2004, 12:10
Hey - I'm only 18!

Isn't there anything better than bog-standard trainers for dusty floors?

srb
-10th May 2004, 12:50
Adidas 'gold' used to be available in two different versions. One with the regular octagonal tread, and one that had a completely smooth tread.

The regular tread was for ordinary pistes, the smooth ones were for metallic pistes.

Both versions also had two cut outs in the base of the sole to acts as air pockets, to cushion the feet as they were stamped down on the floor. I reckon the smooth ones were the best fencing shoe Adidas ever made.

The new retro gold stripe is a bit like the Adidas 'Samba' pretending to be Adidas 'Kick'. So I wonder if the gold stripe are any good for actually fencing in, or just posing?

srb

J_D
-11th May 2004, 09:30
I loved fencing in my motor racing boots [maybe it was the fact that they're bright red]....then they became fashionable too and it's more difficult to get hold of the fire proof ones :(

They're crap for normal use as they have zero shock absorbsion. Mine have zero griop as well now cos I've worn them smooth

Threestain
-11th May 2004, 09:44
I reckon all the current fencing shoes leave a lot to be desired. Why do the 1964 olympic shoes bear a frightening resemblance to current fencing shoes (or at the very least to the adistar ones of recent years)? Is it because they are the pinnacle of development? Doubt it. Is it because they tend not to put as much R&D into fencing shoes as into other sports which have a higher turnover, and demand more from the shoes. Possibly.

With the exception of the equipment shoes, there is virtually no difference in fencing shoes over the years. Also the equipment shoes are, in my opinion of course, rubbish and dangerous - I for one have had injuries caused solely by using for fencing (not walking around which is even worse). But its probably just me.

Abroad on the international epee circuit you would be very hard pushed to find many who wear equipment shoes, or even 'fencing' shoes. Most wear tennis (France) or handball (Germany) or volleyball shoes (the Equip shoe). Much like people here are starting to do. You get more for your money, and a vast reduction in the sore feet after competitions

gbm
-11th May 2004, 10:02
Lots of British people seem to wear squash shoes, or is that my imagination? Why does every country seem to have it's 'favourite' shoes?

Leonardofury
-11th May 2004, 10:23
I know several people who wear squash shoes. I personally use a pair of reebok hexalite's for their grip. I then ended up with some spare sorbathane insoles so they've been thrown in to. They suit me fine and they've lasted me nearly 3 years now.

Threestain
-11th May 2004, 12:08
Lots of british people use squash shoes because they are cheap, effective and don't slip on the poor flooring in most sports centres.

It depends on what is cheapest in each country - the shoes I use are the same price abroad in term of numbers, but in Euros.

Rdb811
-11th May 2004, 13:11
I suspect it depends on what sport is popular in each country - handball isn't played in Britain, squash is.

The Hi-Tec squash shoes are cheap and good - you're not paying through the nose for the brand name.

I would have thought that most indoor sports shoes would have similar characteristics.

I'll add that I showed my Adidas Hi to my podiatrist and he thought they were a ood shoe in terms of support etc.

Threestain
-11th May 2004, 13:20
As in the boot version of the equipment shoes? They're not too bad, shame about the price! :)

The low ones are the ones I have a problem with. I seriously think that canted shoes are a bad idea. Especially with most people already rolling their foot it just exacerbates the problem. Also makes retreating much harder

gbm
-11th May 2004, 13:32
My Viktorias aren't canted. Are they more European and less unusually designed than most fencing shoes?

Rdb811
-11th May 2004, 13:44
Originally posted by Threestain
As in the boot version of the equipment shoes? They're not too bad, shame about the price! :)



The boots - fortunately they were half price (these were the last of the older version of the equipment's - made in 1999 in Poland, per the label).

J_D
-11th May 2004, 13:55
I tend to find with squash shoes etc that the bit of the sole that curls up around the toe catches occasionally as I move forward. this leads to a nasty ripping in the foot :S I find shoes with a narrow sole corrects this by ensuring that the front foot is properly in line

pinkelephant
-11th May 2004, 16:37
Originally posted by Threestain
Also the equipment shoes are, in my opinion of course, rubbish and dangerous - I for one have had injuries caused solely by using for fencing (not walking around which is even worse). But its probably just me.



I'm not sure it is just you. Do you know whether any research has been done? I have had a very nasty calf injury since wearing them (complete rupture of one of the muscles in the back calf) and I have seen at least 3 other rear leg calf injuries. What I don't know is whether these injuries are equally likely while wearing other shoes.

uk_45
-11th May 2004, 17:07
Try dfferent shoes and see what happens

Rdb811
-11th May 2004, 17:25
Not sure how you'd proove the theorum or obtain non-anecdotal evidence.

Neo
-11th May 2004, 17:35
Originally posted by Rdb811
I suspect it depends on what sport is popular in each country - handball isn't played in Britain

I play "handball" all the time :P

Neo
-11th May 2004, 17:36
Originally posted by pinkelephant
I'm not sure it is just you. Do you know whether any research has been done? I have had a very nasty calf injury since wearing them (complete rupture of one of the muscles in the back calf) and I have seen at least 3 other rear leg calf injuries. What I don't know is whether these injuries are equally likely while wearing other shoes.

I've found the need to stretch my cals since using em - probably due to the lower heel

Threestain
-11th May 2004, 22:12
I actually think its to do with overstressing the lateral calf muscles. Especially when doing active movements. There is a reason why fencing is taught in a certain way - to prevent injury in general. The shoes make you roll your foot more, not less and even when your foot is flat on the shoe its tilted and the same goes for when the shoe is flat on the floor.

Surely to get appropriate data you would merely do a survey, as in most research of the sort - admittedly not perfect but best you can do in the circumstances

DrT
-12th May 2004, 08:00
Originally posted by Threestain
Surely to get appropriate data you would merely do a survey, as in most research of the sort - admittedly not perfect but best you can do in the circumstances

Yes, but I think you'd have trouble finding a large enough sample without considerable effort.

Personally, I've never had trouble with squash shoes so I'll stick with them. It's not worth the risk that there might be a problem with the specialist ones.

Australian
-12th May 2004, 09:32
Originally posted by DrT
Yes, but I think you'd have trouble finding a large enough sample without considerable effort.

Personally, I've never had trouble with squash shoes so I'll stick with them. It's not worth the risk that there might be a problem with the specialist ones.

i've never had a problem...

Rdb811
-12th May 2004, 23:17
Tried my trusty old Hi-Tec squash shoes and found that the heel is too solid to advance tappng the front toe properly.

Threestain
-13th May 2004, 10:04
Originally posted by Rdb811
Tried my trusty old Hi-Tec squash shoes and found that the heel is too solid to advance tappng the front toe properly.

That makes no sense

Rdb811
-13th May 2004, 14:58
There isn't a curved heel in the same way there is on fencing shoes, thus making one more flat footed i.e making using the front heel (and tapping the front of the foot) more difficult.

Which is a way of saying ignore my previous posts saying using squash shoes was OK.

gbm
-13th May 2004, 15:07
Originally posted by Rdb811
Tried my trusty old Hi-Tec squash shoes and found that the heel is too solid to advance tappng the front toe properly.

Don't you advance heel first?

Neo
-13th May 2004, 15:09
head first is more fun

uk_45
-13th May 2004, 15:15
yeah i know what you mean goodbadandme you place the heel down first and then the rest of your foot follows, like a hinge with the floor if that makes sense.

Threestain
-13th May 2004, 15:21
I think it might just be those shoes

I don't think you should be using that part of shoe anyway, really. Obviously there is a margin of error granted, but the flatness should not make a difference really

uk_45
-13th May 2004, 15:30
You should step forward heel first and and so the rolled edge at the back of the shoe is much better.

gbm
-13th May 2004, 15:54
So my Viktorias (which have a rolled heel) are actually ideal after all...

Rdb811
-14th May 2004, 00:37
There is a small but noticeable difference between the heels - advancing on the front heel is harder work - basically the HiTec heel is more like a normal pair of shoes.

srb
-14th May 2004, 13:20
Originally posted by goodbadandme
Don't you advance heel first?

What?

This wasn't a serious question was it?

If you advance heel first, it wouldn't make any difference what shoes your wore, in fact it probably wouldn't make any difference if you left you shoes in your bag and popped down to the hospital to have both your legs removed, because your foot work would be cr*P.

srb (shocked):dizzy:

gbm
-14th May 2004, 13:22
I shall rephrase that as land heel first, lifting the toes slightly as your foot moves.

uk_45
-14th May 2004, 14:51
Thats what id say, mind i know my foot work is poor

gbm
-14th May 2004, 15:38
The only way I can think of going heel first would be to have your front foot twisted round, so that you were sort of facing backwards...

oddball
-14th May 2004, 19:37
and why would you do that?

TBennett
-14th May 2004, 19:52
the phrase "tactical retreat" springs to mind :tongue:

gbm
-14th May 2004, 20:36
I'm not sure fencing backwards would really be a good idea...

Neo
-14th May 2004, 20:48
Originally posted by goodbadandme
I'm not sure fencing backwards would really be a good idea...

good way to get a red card ;)

uk_45
-14th May 2004, 21:25
And to lose!

gbm
-14th May 2004, 21:35
There are two ways to completely avoid being hit:
1) Win 15-0 or on time before you reach 15
2) Get carded off the piste

uk_45
-15th May 2004, 19:07
Don't turn up?

gbm
-15th May 2004, 19:22
Indeed! A third way, then!

Moose
-23rd May 2004, 02:28
Lol I'll stick to my Vans as size 13 fencing shoes are interesting to find.

uk_45
-23rd May 2004, 08:51
So they'd be size 14 vans from cheshire oaks would they?

gbm
-23rd May 2004, 09:45
Wearing vans on your feet?

symon
-23rd May 2004, 14:29
Originally posted by Hellphire
the phrase "tactical retreat" springs to mind :tongue:
or in laymanns terms ...................... argh run awayyyyyyyyyyyy!!!!:grin:

gbm
-23rd May 2004, 14:36
Half of footwork is going backwards (roughly)

J_D
-23rd May 2004, 16:52
Vans on your feet: footwork in transit??:dizzy:

Moose
-23rd May 2004, 17:53
Lol, That was poor.

gbm
-23rd May 2004, 19:05
I thought it was rather funny, actually! :tongue:

J_D
-23rd May 2004, 20:15
no, he was right, it was poor!

Juicy
-23rd May 2004, 20:20
that joke was *so* beneath you J_D...

uk_45
-23rd May 2004, 21:16
It was dreadfull

Moose
-23rd May 2004, 22:49
Hehehe, don't doubt me :tongue: